damage to fish :mad:

[danny1234]

i hate it when i catch a carp or any other fish and its lip is all mangled just wanted to no how this happens
i cort a carp the other week and its lip looked like it had been cut of with a knie i didnt no how it feeds it was thant bad
so im posting this thread to find out how its caursed thanks

[danny1234]

( knife )

[richard e.]

with the greatest of respect danny,

if you care that much about fish in commercial fisheries, dont spend your days trying to stick hooks in em mate. take up golf or something.

[FORDY-1]

Deformed mouths are caused when the cartilidge is broken etc as this is what form's the mouth,the main thing that doe's it is when you see someone fishing a bolt/self hooking rig and the lines streaming from the spool,a lot of people for some unkown reason strike,this is when the fish is already hooked????????????

[SPADGER]

Damage

Richard E.
Why shouldn't he care about the fish he is catching.
Whether they are commercial or wild they are all fish.
Silly statements like yours sets angling back years mate. Maybe it's you who should take up golf.
So. " With the greatest of respect". Which you obviously don't have when it comes to fish.
Go find another sport to occupy yourself.

[jeff]

Well wrote Spadger, to many idiots still use barbed hooks on commie's and canals,

[fishster]

Why dont they ban barbed hooks

[richard e.]

Richard E.
Why shouldn't he care about the fish he is catching.
Whether they are commercial or wild they are all fish.
Silly statements like yours sets angling back years mate. Maybe it's you who should take up golf.
So. " With the greatest of respect". Which you obviously don't have when it comes to fish.
Go find another sport to occupy yourself.

no respect intended here fella but the simple act of angling for fish using a hook is likely to cause stress and damage.
not something you would do to something you care that much about is it?
if you want to live in your little bubble that thinks your doin them a favour by catchin em then get on with it. i dunno, next people will be givin them names (what a stupid thing to do)
i myself have got my eyes open!

now before your next rant, ive been doin this stuff for 34 years. ive never deliberately harmed a fish. ive never banked carp without a quality unhooking mat. ive fell out with, and punched people when they have not done the same.

but dont preach to me how much we "care" about stuff we stick hooks in and inprison them in nets all day coz it dont ad up mate.

[richard e.]

Why dont they ban barbed hooks

because the jury is still out as to wether they cause less damage to fish than barbless.

[fish farmer]

with the greatest of respect danny,

If you care that much about fish in commercial fisheries, dont spend your days trying to stick hooks in em mate. take up golf or something.

Deformed mouths are caused when the cartilidge is broken etc as this is what form's the mouth,the main thing that doe's it is when you see someone fishing a bolt/self hooking rig and the lines streaming from the spool,a lot of people for some unkown reason strike,this is when the fish is already hooked????????????

Well wrote Spadger, to many idiots still use barbed hooks on commie's and canals,

Why dont they ban barbed hooks

With respect guys, we can all go round blaming each other and barbed hooks and bolt rigs, but the truth is, in my opinion, it is anglers inability to balance their tackle properly that often causes this kind of damage we are talking about here. Yes bolt rigs can cause the damage, especially as fordy says people strike like loonies when the fish is already hooked. But it is also easy enough to cause such damage using too heavy elastic, or line, with too small a hook.

IMO, if you put enough pressure on sharpened, bent wire, whether there is a barb or not, you can rip it through the skin or flesh. For a barb to cause such damage, surely it would have to be pulled backwards?? Any damage, by any hook, leaves an avenue for bacteria to get in and quite oten, it is bacteria that causes the extent of the damage you see on fishs' mouths. The bacteria eats away the flesh, but, if the fish is lucky, it eventually heals, leaving the sort of 'parrot mouths' we are all familiar with!

I remember many years ago when barbed hooks were the only ones available and I honestly can't remember a fish with damage as extensive as I see these days. Having said that, commercial fsheries and the kind of tackle you see used at them these days didn't exist! How many of you fish rivers and see this sort of damage?

There are fisheries out there where ONLY barbed hooks are allowed - Rob Hales' Monument for instance - and I have never heard anyone say his fish have damaged mouths.

Perhaps we need to look at the full picture at commercials in brief (I have posted along similar lines in more length before) - massively overstocked fish means more stress, more angling pressure, more damage (less face it, many of these fish are hooked and landed very quickly indeed and there is considerable force involved!), more avenues for bacteria to enter, end of !

Fordy - very good point mate, but how many anglers use bolt rigs on commercials? As you know, such things are banned at our place, but there was a bloke yesterday using an 18-20 elastic and a 14 hook. I personally wouldn't use a 10lb line with such a small hook, which I believe would be the equivalent ?? I also believe that there are no fish in our match pools that couldn't be controlled with a 14 elastic. Match angling on commercials demands that fish are landed quickly and modern tackle used on commercials is designed to meet that demand... and that's where the damage can be done, in my opinion. Look at 'yank and bank' margin poles - the clue is in the name... they are banned at cob house before anyone feels the need!

It's not just the tackle though, as I have said, angler knowledge and ability have a lot to do with it... balanced tackle is what is important. Look at the likes of John Wilson. For all his general fishing, barbel included, he uses a 4lb main line and steps up to a 6lb in snaggier waters !!

[richard e.]

fish farmer

your comments make a lot of sense and in a way you tell it like i would like to but in a much more diplomatic way

the tactics used today are so different and in my experience have only really come about since the meteoric rise in fishing popularity since mania and the like.
i can also well remember the days where barbed hooks were all you could get and parrot mouth was a very rare thing to see on the bank. now its common. there is a small pair of carp/ match lakes at the bottom of the village where i used to spend a lot of time. if you catch a carp without damage, thats rare!
but more often than anything else you would catch one with a bit to much energy, get it on the bank and then remove the pole rigs and the like from its mouth that its been trailing round for months.
imo, there arnt nearly enough caring owners around. you obviously do care but lets face it, many dont give a damn whats going on as long as the wonga keeps coming in.

[fish farmer]

Thanks, but I am just telling it how it is.

I don't think it's that they all don't care richard, many of them just don't realise or understand about how to look after a water. Many fisheries are owned by anglers - and have no qualification other than that - and with the best will in the world, most anglers know little about fish biology and physiology. I had to explain the full ins and outs of why fish get ulcers to one very well known fishery owner after he tried to blame our fish.... three months after he stocked them into his water and had matches on there straight away!!

There are, however, some well known commercials that treat carp as a 'throw away' commodity. If the antis ever get hold of them...... we are in trouble! They would also love your original comment my friend, so perhaps a bit of that diplomacy wouldn't go amiss! Don't go punching too many people eh... unles they are antis, of course

[vidas]

as fishermen we shud all care i tried explaining to the woman who own foxhills all her carp look like john merick the faces on the poor sods i do think its alot to do with kids fishing barbed hooks and ripping them out cause not having the skill to do it properly, she has a barbless hook policy in 20 years she has never checked my hook i caught a handfull of carp 2 weeks ago all with big barbed hooks in there mouth so i removed them and gave them to her and she still went round and didnt check anyone its not just kids there is adults as well who do it, the last time my hooks was checked was 15 years ago at morlands they walked the pools with a towel and put everyones hooks in to check if barbed or not maybe more owners shud go back to doin that? its just my opion but we have all seen kids unhookin and end up with a lip left on the hook fishfarmer is right some owners think lets cut the grass collect the money thats it there is so much into ownin a fishery

[young_match_fisher]

i care about fish well fair, at the end of the day you want to come back and catch the fish again, so i think its just right that you look after the fish the best you can. if the fish dies its one less fish we can catch.

[danny1234]

vidas this is y i posted the thread i was fishing foxhills and i had a 10 lb carp and it had no lip
and to be honest i was fishing at pool hall and i seen a kid lift up a carp round about 5 lb out the water with his carp rod when i mean lifted i mean in the air i also record seeing him get cort in the tree with carp hanging in the air to be honist im 18 and i have loads of respect for the fish and the sport.
and to be honest richard it sounds like to me you dont care what happens to the fish as long as you catch

to be honest like i sed im only 18 but i think you should have all the respect for the fish you catch at the end of the day

and i do love golf i play some times with my dad

BUT FISHING IS MY LIFE